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**02-22-2016, 01:58 PM**

Discuss with me whether you liked or hated it, whether it's judging, RP rules, format, or matches.

Tommy Gunn · (02-22-2016)

I enjoyed it. As someone with a pretty hectic schedule I enjoyed the RP limit. I thought it was pretty fair if not perfect. Having word limits forces you to make quality roleplays and the 3 rp limit allows for a nice back and forth.

The results themselves were enjoyable for both shows. Loved the new announcing/reporting team that adds some fun flavor to the show.

I can't speak to the judging as I did not judge anything for the show and don't know exactly what criteria you used.

Having said that...where my money bitch?

Maverick · (02-22-2016)

Overall, I liked the return of Shove-It. It promotes a lighter schedule, which is great for new people who aren't sure about the XWF or if you're an old legend returning to the game after a long hiatus, and I do like that.

Now, what I don't like is the RP limits. Don't get me wrong, I like having a limited amount of RPs to work with, but something I don't like is being restricted to one RP on the last day. It's one thing if it's your only RP, but when you posted before the last day and needed something that would take more than 2000 words you're basically fucked over.

That's another thing I dislike. The word count. Throughout my first RP I found myself chopping off a lot of words because I kept exceeding 2k, and considering what words one chops off, the entire RP can change. Throughout my second RP as well I wrote less than I should have because I didn't want to risk going over the limit.

Besides that, however, it was good. I liked the formatting, with the announce team, match writing, etc. Definitely a very good show.

Tommy Gunn · **02-22-2016, 02:18 PM**

(02-22-2016, 02:16 PM)Maverick Said: Overall, I liked the return of Shove-It. It promotes a lighter schedule, which is great for new people who aren't sure about the XWF or if you're an old legend returning to the game after a long hiatus, and I do like that.

Just so we are clear, am I old or a legend?

Maverick · (02-22-2016)

(02-22-2016, 02:18 PM)Tommy Gunn Said:
(02-22-2016, 02:16 PM)Maverick Said: Overall, I liked the return of Shove-It. It promotes a lighter schedule, which is great for new people who aren't sure about the XWF or if you're an old legend returning to the game after a long hiatus, and I do like that.

Just so we are clear, am I old or a legend?

Just old.

Mr Killjoy · (02-22-2016)

Was a good show, and I too like the RP limit for Shove It, I think it should be 3 RPs with a 2000-3000 max/min word count in general I've said that before, except for main events/PPV matches then make it unlimited RPs/wordcount sure.

Blue Gator · **02-22-2016, 02:27 PM**

I agree with most of the stuff the other people have said but I think you should keep the word limit. It makes it a bit more challenging to write a good role play in a smaller amount of space while still being light.

3 RPs is the perfect amount for a good trashtalk back and forth like Gunn said, although I only managed to get one up.

The whole show was fun as fuck and it seems less competitive than the other shows, which is a nice variation.

Match writing was good. I enjoyed that too.

Judging was fine.

**02-22-2016, 02:40 PM**

Yeah I get how aggravating it is if you're trying to cram in your final sentence. What I might do is say, your rp must end after the SENTENCE that your 2000th word is in. So rather than 2000, you sometimes get 2002, 2008, etc.

Scully · **02-22-2016, 02:41 PM**

Although I wasn't involved at the Shove-It event, the idea of a rp limit suits me for definite. If you have a role player doing 3 each for example, then I consider that a fair contest.

But that's just me lol

Mr Killjoy · **02-22-2016, 02:49 PM**

(02-22-2016, 02:41 PM)Scully Said: Although I wasn't involved at the Shove-It event, the idea of a rp limit suits me for definite. If you have a role player doing 3 each for example, then I consider that a fair contest.

But that's just me lol

Yeah basically, if you've got two RPers who are around the same quality, both one posts like 7 and the other only manages to put out three, then yeah lol.

Thats kinda why I don't want to face Fern unless its a week I'm barely working haha that boy goes HAM with his RP count.

Tommy Gunn · (02-22-2016)

(02-22-2016, 02:21 PM)Maverick Said:
(02-22-2016, 02:18 PM)Tommy Gunn Said:
(02-22-2016, 02:16 PM)Maverick Said: Overall, I liked the return of Shove-It. It promotes a lighter schedule, which is great for new people who aren't sure about the XWF or if you're an old legend returning to the game after a long hiatus, and I do like that.

Just so we are clear, am I old or a legend?

Just old.

Dead to me.

Chris MacBeth · (02-22-2016)

The other thing to consider is that it won't always be 3. If I book 2 guys who I think can work with a limit of 5, or if they ask, then Ill book that. Same if we wana do 2 or, imagine this; 1! I went with 3 for last week because I thought that was a good limit for 4 on 4s.

**Vincent Lane** · **02-22-2016, 03:38 PM**

I thought it was great. I think a lot of people enjoy a limit because it takes a lot of the stress off. There are some guys, like Gunn in the past, Fernando, Frodo, myself even, that will go balls-out and throw up like 7-10 RPs, but it tends to feel like a chore more than something you are enjoying after a while.

There's always been the option to have limits, but it was never the default. I also didn't feel like it hindered my creativity or storytelling in any way.

I saw no faults in any writing or judging either. I think all the decisions were the right ones, although the end of the main event could have gone either way.

**"Loverboy" Vinnie Lane** · (02-23-2016)

As far as the limits go (word counts, max RP limit per match, only 1 RP last day, etc), the person or people running a show are often the one(s) who will benefit the most from such limits... and that's really important for us to always be keeping in mind.

From the RPer perspective though, the limits are almost imaginary if you think about it. There's a large pool of people who would be able to formulate and hit the exact same quality/score in any given week no matter what limits you give them. Having the limits doesn't force you to write better quality... that only happens if you convince yourself of the illusion, and have previously convinced yourself that you're supposed to be lazy or sloppy in the absence of RP limits... That's the only reason you'd find yourself creating higher quality work as a result of limits.

One issue that always comes up when limits are used for more than just a brief stint, is the misconception that "hitting your max limit" in ANY way should be your goal or alternatively be your failure if you didn't reach the max RP mark. That's a huge problem because then some judges (especially guest judges) will start thinking "well if Robbie only hit 2 RPs and Vinnie hit 3 RPs this week, and their quality was about equal, let's just let the "sheer effort" category be what decides the winner"... and that becomes too easy of a way out for the judges sometimes. It's like nstead of getting out the magnifying glass, you'll want to just get out the scale. I've also seen the same thing happen many times in the past when it comes to word counts per RP.

I've discovered RP limits DO tend to work a lot better in multi-person matches. The bigger, the better. So for a 4 on 4 type of situation, it's perfect because some of the illusions about "hitting your max" are lessened in the group environment. It seems to become a much bigger deal when it's 1 on 1 and "person A" stresses themselves out all week trying to force out the "max limit" just to make sure they match their opponent who always hits the max limit. Limits can actually burn a person out faster, because remember, even ONE ROLEPLAY can beat somebody who posted multiple RPs if that ONE roleplay fully supplies relevance and other important elements better than any of the opponent's multiple RPs were able to do individually or combined. Now take that person who's great with 1 hit knockouts (or 2 hits/RPs) and put them in a match with a 4 RP limit. Pressure is now on that RPer to go beyond the number they usually do because now they're in a match where numbers matter. (even though they don't matter)

One day I would like to find a great solution for "reasonably limited" RPing that doesn't create even the slightest hint of belief that the actual numbers matter. Our anti-flood rules were a big step in that direction but I'm still working on coming up with an even better and more fluid system that will keep things easy AND fun not only for the judges but also for RPers with any availability.

I fell asleep in the middle of writing this. Good chance some of it doesn't make sense. lol

Mr Killjoy · **02-22-2016, 10:29 PM**

Good points Shane. I do sometimes feel like I HAVE to post the same amount as my opponent ( if I feel like we're around the same quality or their quality is better) but thats just me. I prefer limits because I think 3 RP max is ideal for me, since trash talk is my strong suit and not storytelling, I always feel burnt out doing a 4th or beyond RP, theres only SO MUCH you can trash without beginning to repeat yourself.

~~Ginger Snaps~~ · **02-22-2016, 10:37 PM**

Personally, I always hit about three as Ginger, not because I set limits, but any more than three, and I feel like I'm not being as entertaining, but I do that without limits. So, that aspect doesn't affect me much. But, I do see how it could stifle someone, or make someone feel like they're slacking for not hitting the limit. I guess it really depends on the person, though. I dunno. I also think maybe doing limits on how many the group can do total vs how many each person can do is something to explore.

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